[manjaro-dev] sonar iso and calamares
Simon Eigeldinger
simon.eigeldinger at vol.at
Sun Aug 21 20:35:23 CEST 2016
Hi,
i guess/wonder if we also could get with a smaller iso as well.
because installing apps isn't difficult.
we could have a kind of adding packages package list in the installer
where the people could check some recommended packages.
this list could be very long which actually shouldn't be a problem.
but i am torn between that and the other things. *smile*
i find both things interesting.
greetings,
simon
Am 21.08.2016 um 20:32 schrieb artoo:
> How you configure your sonar iso in terms of calamares is up to you.
>
> But what I am saying, we really need a slim profile to test sonar iso.
>
> Apps are basically only bloat, and maingoal would be to make it
> perfectly working with orca and stuff that all apps use for
> accessibility, it a matter of tweaking gschema.override eventually.
>
>
> Am 21.08.2016 um 20:17 schrieb manjaro-dev-request at manjaro.org:
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>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 9 (Simon Eigeldinger)
>> 2. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 9 (Philip M?ller)
>> 3. Setting an email subject (was: Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol
>> 29, Issue 9) (Jonathon Fernyhough)
>> 4. help reporting a kernel bug badly needed (kendell clark)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 17:57:31 +0200
>> From: Simon Eigeldinger <simon.eigeldinger at vol.at>
>> To: manjaro-dev at manjaro.org
>> Subject: Re: [manjaro-dev] manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 9
>> Message-ID: <5ba9681e-08e0-5214-cd2e-d78f1a84f3d2 at vol.at>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> thinking about it again its also convinient to have a full iso. *smile*
>>
>> greetings,
>> simon
>>
>>
>> Am 21.08.2016 um 17:55 schrieb Simon Eigeldinger:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> or we provide a minimal iso by default and then let the user install
>>> what he wants.
>>> basically a list box with checkboxes in the installer where the user can
>>> check what he/she wants to install.
>>>
>>> greetings,
>>> simon
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 21.08.2016 um 17:32 schrieb kendell clark:
>>>> hi
>>>>
>>>> I'd like to expand on this. I like your idea, however I think it should
>>>> be optional. That is, you could specify whether you want a full iso,
>>>> which has all the software we include in sonar plus the installer, or a
>>>> minimal one, which contains the minimum amount of stuff needed to get a
>>>> talking desktop, plus maybe some rescue tools and possibly a media
>>>> player or two? I totally agree that it is time consuming to build a
>>>> sonar image but also that the point of sonar is to have an iso image a
>>>> user can put on a flash drive and have all or at least most of the
>>>> software they need to do pretty much anything. Audio editor, video
>>>> editor, audio converter, etc etc etc. Would it be possible to add a
>>>> software page to calamares if the user is using the minimal version so
>>>> they can select which programs they want to install and leave the ones
>>>> they don't off? Also an "install updates" option that way a user gets a
>>>> completely up to date system instead of having to first install and
>>>> then
>>>> install several hundred updates. Just brainstorming. I'm not sure if
>>>> you
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 08/21/2016 10:22 AM, artoo wrote:
>>>>> My thought for sonar was, since we now have calamares and buildiso
>>>>> ready to configure the installer for additionally installing packages
>>>>> from online repo,
>>>>>
>>>>> a hybrid iso, that extracts a basic sonar mate for example, but
>>>>> downloads all the additional apps optionally. So the sonar user would
>>>>> get a basic preconfigured accessible desktop, but he has to download
>>>>> further apps.
>>>>>
>>>>> Reason is, it is really painfully time consuming to tbuild a test
>>>>> sonar iso.
>>>>>
>>>>> With my proposal, we would have a smaller iso, and all the apps will
>>>>> be downloaded by user. We would juust provide what is needed for a
>>>>> sonar user by default.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Marcus
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Am 21.08.2016 um 17:11 schrieb manjaro-dev-request at manjaro.org:
>>>>>> Send manjaro-dev mailing list submissions to
>>>>>> manjaro-dev at manjaro.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>>>>> http://lists.manjaro.org/mailman/listinfo/manjaro-dev
>>>>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>>>>> manjaro-dev-request at manjaro.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>>>>> manjaro-dev-owner at manjaro.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>>> than "Re: Contents of manjaro-dev digest..."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7 (Simon Eigeldinger)
>>>>>> 2. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7 (kendell clark)
>>>>>> 3. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7 (Philip M?ller)
>>>>>> 4. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7 (artoo)
>>>>>> 5. Re: manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7 (kendell clark)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>>> Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 15:09:27 +0200
>>>>>> From: Simon Eigeldinger <simon.eigeldinger at vol.at>
>>>>>> To: manjaro-dev at manjaro.org
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [manjaro-dev] manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7
>>>>>> Message-ID: <ee5bf9ab-730a-5dca-4a61-7b67f0c2785f at vol.at>
>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Marcus,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks for doing that.
>>>>>> that now enables us now to move forward.
>>>>>> btw also its also a good idea to replace gtk2 with gtk3.
>>>>>> gtk2 doesn't get more accessible and also no updates.
>>>>>> so thats also a good thing for the future.
>>>>>> sometimes its good that someone from the outside is cleaning up a
>>>>>> bit.
>>>>>> *smile*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> greetings,
>>>>>> simon
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 21.08.2016 um 13:44 schrieb artoo:
>>>>>>> Hi kendell,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I removed the root-overlay, this stuff shouldn't be there.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Reason is, calamares will now configure the target installation,
>>>>>>> rather
>>>>>>> than letting buildiso do it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Your stuff from root-overlay has been saved, its not lost, but
>>>>>>> notice,
>>>>>>> with removed root-overlay, lightdm starts to talk. I moved some
>>>>>>> things
>>>>>>> in sonar profile in proper places.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is work in progress.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As for calamares and accessibility, generally, deprecating thus and
>>>>>>> cli-installer lets us focus on one installer only. Its a
>>>>>>> nightmare to
>>>>>>> support 3 different installers. This is also work in progress to
>>>>>>> eventually make sonar a calamares module, that specifically
>>>>>>> configures
>>>>>>> sonar stuff.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marcus(udeved)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 21.08.2016 um 12:00 schrieb manjaro-dev-request at manjaro.org:
>>>>>>>> Send manjaro-dev mailing list submissions to
>>>>>>>> manjaro-dev at manjaro.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>>>>>>> http://lists.manjaro.org/mailman/listinfo/manjaro-dev
>>>>>>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>>>>>>> manjaro-dev-request at manjaro.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>>>>>>> manjaro-dev-owner at manjaro.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>>>>>>> than "Re: Contents of manjaro-dev digest..."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 1. thus is gone, help needed (kendell clark)
>>>>>>>> 2. Re: thus is gone, help needed (kendell clark)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>>>>> Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 04:00:55 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: kendell clark <coffeekingms at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "manjaro-dev at manjaro.org" <manjaro-dev at manjaro.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: [manjaro-dev] thus is gone, help needed
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <57B96DC7.5020409 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> hi all
>>>>>>>> I just got a message on the sonar mailing list that udevd removed
>>>>>>>> thus
>>>>>>>> from the repositories. I'm not complaining about this at all, but
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> does mean I'll need the calamares installer accessible by the next
>>>>>>>> sonar
>>>>>>>> release or I won't have an installer to put into sonar. Would some
>>>>>>>> people from hear mind contacting the calamares devs to emphasize
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> their installer has to run as a normal user in order for it to be
>>>>>>>> accessible? Phil and I have told this to the only calamares
>>>>>>>> developer I
>>>>>>>> know, called teo, and he agrees with me, but so far calamares is
>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>> run as root, which for some reason I still don't understand keeps
>>>>>>>> orca
>>>>>>>> from seeing it. Calamares is already completely accessible with the
>>>>>>>> exception of some small bugs when run as a normal user, so the
>>>>>>>> installer
>>>>>>>> only has a couple of very small bugs that need fixing but when it's
>>>>>>>> run
>>>>>>>> as root orca can't see it. The only reason I'm bringing this up
>>>>>>>> again is
>>>>>>>> because it's now the only installer I have to work with so it
>>>>>>>> needs to
>>>>>>>> be accessible. I'm asking more people to get involved so I can't be
>>>>>>>> ignored easily. If only a few people want a bug to get fixed it
>>>>>>>> can be
>>>>>>>> put off with the assumption that not enough users are affected by
>>>>>>>> it so
>>>>>>>> why fix it. From what teo tells me, the calamares people are
>>>>>>>> reluctant
>>>>>>>> to rewrite calamares to run as an unprivilaged user and use
>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> like policy kit or pam to elevate when needed, saying that it's a
>>>>>>>> lot of
>>>>>>>> work. I don't know if this is true but it either needs to be
>>>>>>>> done or
>>>>>>>> patched, or something so that it doesn't run as root or people who
>>>>>>>> use
>>>>>>>> screen readers won't be able to use it. I think screen magnifiers
>>>>>>>> and on
>>>>>>>> screen keyboards might still be able to work with it, but I'm not
>>>>>>>> positive about that.
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 2
>>>>>>>> Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2016 04:09:41 -0500
>>>>>>>> From: kendell clark <coffeekingms at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "manjaro-dev at manjaro.org" <manjaro-dev at manjaro.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [manjaro-dev] thus is gone, help needed
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <57B96FD5.1040306 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> hi
>>>>>>>> I've just noticed that most of the files I put in our shared/root
>>>>>>>> overlay are gone. Are they maybe in another repository? I've been
>>>>>>>> flaking a lot over the past week but I'm trying to get back into
>>>>>>>> developing sonar after taking a couple of days off. Also, I've
>>>>>>>> figured
>>>>>>>> out a fix for pulse audio which should improve sound when sonar is
>>>>>>>> run
>>>>>>>> in a vm, allow console speech to work and also keep our setting to
>>>>>>>> allow
>>>>>>>> newly plugged in devices to switch over automatically. Would
>>>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>>> mind writing a script which generates a pulse audio config named
>>>>>>>> 'default.pa' and places it in ~/.config/pulse when the live
>>>>>>>> system is
>>>>>>>> booted? I don't know a thing about sed or I'd try this myself? It
>>>>>>>> should
>>>>>>>> have the following lines in it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> .include /etc/pulse/default.pa #this includes the system pulse
>>>>>>>> configuration file.
>>>>>>>> #switch to newly plugged in sound hardware
>>>>>>>> load-module module-switch-on-connect
>>>>>>>> #enable console screen readers
>>>>>>>> load-module module-native-protocol-unix auth-anonymous=1
>>>>>>>> socket=/tmp/pulse.sock
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If the file is generated on boot I won't have to create a skel
>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>>> and place that file there. I assume my root overlay was deleted to
>>>>>>>> try
>>>>>>>> to de-clutter up our profiles, which I completely understand. The
>>>>>>>> reason
>>>>>>>> I'm asking it to go into the user config folder for pulse instead
>>>>>>>> of the
>>>>>>>> system wide one is because if it's placed in the system wide pulse
>>>>>>>> config file, pulse breaks. I'm not at all sure why, but if it's
>>>>>>>> placed
>>>>>>>> in the ~/.config/pulse folder it works fine.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> kendell clark wrote:
>>>>>>>>> hi all
>>>>>>>>> I just got a message on the sonar mailing list that udevd removed
>>>>>>>>> thus
>>>>>>>>> from the repositories. I'm not complaining about this at all, but
>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>>> does mean I'll need the calamares installer accessible by the next
>>>>>>>>> sonar
>>>>>>>>> release or I won't have an installer to put into sonar. Would some
>>>>>>>>> people from hear mind contacting the calamares devs to emphasize
>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>> their installer has to run as a normal user in order for it to be
>>>>>>>>> accessible? Phil and I have told this to the only calamares
>>>>>>>>> developer I
>>>>>>>>> know, called teo, and he agrees with me, but so far calamares is
>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>> run as root, which for some reason I still don't understand keeps
>>>>>>>>> orca
>>>>>>>>> from seeing it. Calamares is already completely accessible with
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> exception of some small bugs when run as a normal user, so the
>>>>>>>>> installer
>>>>>>>>> only has a couple of very small bugs that need fixing but when
>>>>>>>>> it's run
>>>>>>>>> as root orca can't see it. The only reason I'm bringing this up
>>>>>>>>> again is
>>>>>>>>> because it's now the only installer I have to work with so it
>>>>>>>>> needs to
>>>>>>>>> be accessible. I'm asking more people to get involved so I
>>>>>>>>> can't be
>>>>>>>>> ignored easily. If only a few people want a bug to get fixed it
>>>>>>>>> can be
>>>>>>>>> put off with the assumption that not enough users are affected by
>>>>>>>>> it so
>>>>>>>>> why fix it. From what teo tells me, the calamares people are
>>>>>>>>> reluctant
>>>>>>>>> to rewrite calamares to run as an unprivilaged user and use
>>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>>> like policy kit or pam to elevate when needed, saying that it's a
>>>>>>>>> lot of
>>>>>>>>> work. I don't know if this is true but it either needs to be
>>>>>>>>> done or
>>>>>>>>> patched, or something so that it doesn't run as root or people who
>>>>>>>>> use
>>>>>>>>> screen readers won't be able to use it. I think screen magnifiers
>>>>>>>>> and on
>>>>>>>>> screen keyboards might still be able to work with it, but I'm not
>>>>>>>>> positive about that.
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> manjaro-dev mailing list
>>>>>>>> manjaro-dev at manjaro.org
>>>>>>>> http://lists.manjaro.org/mailman/listinfo/manjaro-dev
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> End of manjaro-dev Digest, Vol 29, Issue 7
>>>>>>>> ******************************************
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> manjaro-dev mailing list
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>>>>>>> http://lists.manjaro.org/mailman/listinfo/manjaro-dev
>>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> manjaro-dev mailing list
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--
Simon Eigeldinger
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